Things that make me rage - Shitty OL Play

[Faux Sean Callahan]

TZ meaning "Tight Zone"?

Yup

 

[Pipe Line]

Yup

This is super elementary of me to say but see I always thought run plays and just calling plays in general was just like how it was done in the NCAA video games lol "RB dive" or "FB Trap" or "4 Verts". And it sounds like those are just concepts of how the play should look but not always how it works and the RB has to find the hole instead of literally just running it up the middle because that's what the play call is. Like IZ should mean run up the middle but if you see day light on the outside, take it and go, instead of just banking on something being open in the middle and if not then the play is fucked.

 

[Faux Sean Callahan]

This is super elementary of me to say but see I always thought run plays and just calling plays in general was just like how it was done in the NCAA video games lol "RB dive" or "FB Trap" or "4 Verts". And it sounds like those are just concepts of how the play should look but not always how it works and the RB has to find the hole instead of literally just running it up the middle because that's what the play call is. Like IZ should mean run up the middle but if you see day light on the outside, take it and go, instead of just banking on something being open in the middle and if not then the play is fucked.

Ya so whenever you have zone running schemes it is more of an art. Whenever you have gap running schemes it is more of a science.

By that I mean is in zone you have an aim point as a RB. So IZ your aim point is the play side OG inside leg. Now where the art comes in is reading that block. Depending on how the block develops the RB can bounce it (most likely to the B gap), bang it (through the A) or bend it back to the back side honey hole. Whenever you are running zone you need to be what is called "slow to, but fast through the hole." Mills struggled a ton early in his time here because he wanted to go and he was running into the backs of the OL. Cockeye really hangs their hat on zone running.

Now a gap running scheme your RB is running to a hole and is going to hit that as hard as possible. This is what Mills was use to. Think Wisconsin here.

Nebraska runs a lot of zone, but we will run some gap schemes.

 

[Pipe Line]

Ya so whenever you have zone running schemes it is more of an art. Whenever you have gap running schemes it is more of a science.

By that I mean is in zone you have an aim point as a RB. So IZ your aim point is the play side OG inside leg. Now where the art comes in is reading that block. Depending on how the block develops the RB can bounce it (most likely to the B gap), bang it (through the A) or bend it back to the back side honey hole. Whenever you are running zone you need to be what is called "slow to, but fast through the hole." Mills struggled a ton early in his time here because he wanted to go and he was running into the backs of the OL. Cockeyes really hangs their hat on zone running.

Now a gap running scheme your RB is running to a hole and is going to hit that as hard as possible. This is what Mills was use to. Think Wisconsin here.

Nebraska runs a lot of zone, but we will run some gap schemes.

So to put a picture in my head, would the 90s smash mouth style be more of the gap scheme? And the modern spread be zone scheme then? That would make sense for Mills if that is the case because he played that style at GA Tech. And would also make sense as to why he did well at the full back position for us when we did that. It's what he's used to and probably likes. If that is the case, I do like the gap scheme style better than. Feels less pretty boy and more smash mouth to me.

 

[slattimer]

So to put a picture in my head, would the 90s smash mouth style be more of the gap scheme? And the modern spread be zone scheme then? That would make sense for Mills if that is the case because he played that style at GA Tech. And would also make sense as to why he did well at the full back position for us when we did that. It's what he's used to and probably likes. If that is the case, I do like the gap scheme style better than. Feels less pretty boy and more smash mouth to me.

90s Nebraska ran the shit out of OZ and IZ.

 

[Faux Sean Callahan]

So to put a picture in my head, would the 90s smash mouth style be more of the gap scheme?

They used a combination. @slattimer can probably answer this better.

And the modern spread be zone scheme then?

The play that brought the spread to become the sexy offense was the ZONE read.

Now the spread system has evolved to use gap and zone schemes. The tough part is usually gap schemes are easier when you have a lead blocker (FB). So because you don't see much FBs on spread teams rosters you will see pullers and using TEs flexed to help lead. We saw Hickman do this quiet a bit last year. It was their short yardage package they went to. Then they ran that pop pass to him to keep teams honest that would have been an easy TD if Pieper doesn't get blown up. The play that everybody hated.

The thing I would be careful is labeling gap as smash mouth and not thinking zone isn't.

That would make sense for Mills if that is the case because he played that style at GA Tech

He played that hit the hole hard role at GA Tech then was in a 22 personnel gap scheme at Juco. He had to learn how to run in a spread zone scheme when he got here.

I really felt like I would have put Mills in the pistol more. I think that would have helped him out and kept some of the principals Frost likes.

 

[Faux Sean Callahan]

90s Nebraska ran the shit out of OZ and IZ.

 

[Pipe Line]

90s Nebraska ran the shit out of OZ and IZ.

So clearly we just need more developed lineman then. That's what I take from that.

 

[Pipe Line]

They used a combination. @slattimer can probably answer this better.


The play that brought the spread to become the sexy offense was the ZONE read.

Now the spread system has evolved to use gap and zone schemes. The tough part is usually gap schemes are easier when you have a lead blocker (FB). So because you don't see much FBs on spread teams rosters you will see pullers and using TEs flexed to help lead. We saw Hickman do this quiet a bit last year. It was their short yardage package they went to. Then they ran that pop pass to him to keep teams honest that would have been an easy TD if Pieper doesn't get blown up. The play that everybody hated.

The thing I would be careful is labeling gap as smash mouth and not thinking zone isn't.


He played that hit the hole hard role at GA Tech then was in a 22 personnel gap scheme at Juco. He had to learn how to run in a spread zone scheme when he got here.

I really felt like I would have put Mills in the pistol more. I think that would have helped him out and kept some of the principals Frost likes.

Is that why he looked so good against Buttgers then? Other than it being Buttgers......because we did more pistol? I liked the pistol stuff. Kind of gave that mixed feel of old school and new school. I can get behind that.


What made him so successful against Wisconsin in 2019? Just finally feeling comfortable with the scheme?

 

[Faux Sean Callahan]

Is that why he looked so good against Buttgers then? Other than it being Buttgers......because we did more pistol? I liked the pistol stuff. Kind of gave that mixed feel of old school and new school. I can get behind that.

You saw a combination of things.

1. It was the biggest commitment to RB run game.
2. It was the healthiest Mills was in a long time.
3. Turner is better run blocker than Jaimes.
4. I do think the pistol got us going more N/S, but also gave us the ability to attack either side of the OL. Making it harder for the DL to run stunt you.

What made him so successful against Wisconsin in 2019? Just finally feeling comfortable with the scheme?

If you watch that game we had a massive tendency breaker there. We primarily ran Mills on inside zone and we killed Wisconsin on Mid zone that game. Frost scheme is also notorious for showing where the ball is going in the run game based on where the RB is lined up. Now he has moved away from that as much.

Don't ask me why, but it sure felt like a light bulb moment for Mills in that game in running zone scheme.

 

[slattimer]

So clearly we just need more developed lineman then. That's what I take from that.

If you want to learn IZ/OZ, go to your local library, and get an interlibrary loan and find the "Assembly Line" By Milt Tenopir. You could find it online for sale, but it's ridiculously expensive. I usually check it out at least once a year. It's kind of a holy grail amongst OL coaches.

 

[Pipe Line]

If you want to learn IZ/OZ, go to your local library, and get an interlibrary loan and find the "Assembly Line" By Milt Tenopir. You could find it online for sale, but it's ridiculously expensive. I usually check it out at least once a year. It's kind of a holy grail amongst OL coaches.

Perfect, thank you for the suggestion!

 

[Faux Sean Callahan]

If you want to learn IZ/OZ, go to your local library, and get an interlibrary loan and find the "Assembly Line" By Milt Tenopir. You could find it online for sale, but it's ridiculously expensive. I usually check it out at least once a year. It's kind of a holy grail amongst OL coaches.

No shit.

The Assembly Line Amazon product ASIN 1887002340

 

[Pipe Line]

You saw a combination of things.

1. It was the biggest commitment to RB run game.
2. It was the healthiest Mills was in a long time.
3. Turner is better run blocker than Jaimes.
4. I do think the pistol got us going more N/S, but also gave us the ability to attack either side of the OL. Making it harder for the DL to run stunt you.

If you watch that game we had a massive tendency breaker there. We primarily ran Mills on inside zone and we killed Wisconsin on Mid zone that game. Frost scheme is also notorious for showing where the ball is going in the run game based on where the RB is lined up. Now he has moved away from that as much.

Don't ask me why, but it sure felt like a light bulb moment for Mills in that game in running zone scheme.

So obviously the pistol worked pretty well, then why not do that the majority of the time instead of shot gun with the RB right next to you? Almost feels like it doesn't give anything away based on positioning like the other way does. I find it very rare that if the RB is lined up directly to the left of the QB in shot gun, that the run will go left. Feel like it would be more strategic to go pistol more?

 

[Faux Sean Callahan]

So obviously the pistol worked pretty well, then why not do that the majority of the time instead of shot gun with the RB right next to you? Almost feels like it doesn't give anything away based on positioning like the other way does. I find it very rare that if the RB is lined up directly to the left of the QB in shot gun, that the run will go left. Feel like it would be more strategic to go pistol more?

No clue. I know enough about most of this to be dangerous.

If you go play action it can limit your QBs vision to execute the fake being in pistol vs regular gun. It can limit some of your back blocking on a jet sweep series. I can also see it limiting what your back can do in the passing game.

So to me you gain some advantages being in pistol in the run game, but lose some advantages in the passing game.

 

[Pipe Line]

No clue. I know enough about most of this to be dangerous.

If you go play action it can limit your QBs vision to execute the fake being in pistol vs regular gun. It can limit some of your back blocking on a jet sweep series. I can also see it limiting what your back can do in the passing game.

So to me you gain some advantages being in pistol in the run game, but lose some advantages in the passing game.

Pick and choose battle I guess. I appreciate your insight!

 

[Faux Sean Callahan]

I still remember in the mlpfc you let me pick an offensive play for your team. Believe it was a fb dive that got like 2 yards. Mucho grande respect for you lat,
So glad you are here w your football intelligence

Should've went with spider 2 y banana.. Or wasp.





Spider 2y banana because it has a cool name and wasp because chicks dig the long ball

 

[Faux Sean Callahan]

90s Nebraska ran the shit out of OZ and IZ.

Another thing that I just thought of was how Zatascha was complaining how the run scheme we were trying to execute wasn't physical like how they use to do it.

I just was taken back like iz is iz. That doesn't change the physicality of the play.

Having one of the best OL ever in school history vs having one with 3 freshmen on it changes physicality.

You should never listen to him speak. He basically tries to get the run the ball guy going sexually when he has a mic and losses his knowledge of the game.

 

[Pipe Line]

Anybody know anything about QB play specifically? Plays, reads, where Adrian is supposed to go/do, etc? That'd be fun

 

[Faux Sean Callahan]

Anybody know anything about QB play specifically? Plays, reads, where Adrian is supposed to go/do, etc? That'd be fun

Enough to be dangerous