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Opinions on the Option

Yeah, I become a condescending asshole on tater island. Mainly because I just can't take some of the stupid. Because some of it is so bad, you can't explain any sense to them because of preconceived notions that are completely wrong, or just too stupid to get it if it's spelled out in front of them.

In terms of Frost's offense, IMO, it can and eventually will be a good offense in the B1G. The elements are there to stress defenses. But yeah, it's going to take time. When your OL is sub-par, which after the OSU game I was fully on board thinking okay, the OL/DL looks to be better. Now, It's head scratcher as why they've regressed so much after looking like they did vs OSU. But when your OL is like that, it sucks and doesn't matter what you run.

I am biased towards Frost's Offense. I like the concepts, I know the concepts pretty IMO. And when you've got dudes to run it, it's good shit. Personal Opinion, 4 verts is the best play in football. It has every answer in the book on how to beat coverages with the adjustments within it. Hell, 4 verts is damn near a system in itself, especially with the variety that Frost has. 3 verts is another, and realistically, it's the exact same as 4 verts without a numbers vert. They have mesh and drive in their repertoire. Their run game is pretty diverse, mixing in gap and zone running game, and there are RPOs built in to damn near every run, and they can read damn near every defender on the field. They've ran your typical EMOL reads, they've ran midline reads, box LBs reads, apex LB reads, and 3rd level $ reads. That's a ton of fucking shit to do. And maybe be an indicator on why they're struggling some.

I can't remember which game it was, wasn't Ohio State, probably NW, but We ran a shit ton of the stick concept with a backside concept. I'm pretty much a huge proponent of D. Gonzalez in the passing game, and he has a principle called RAM - which is "Read Away from Mike" and is usually paired with stick. If the Mike goes to the Stick, read the backside combo, Mike doesn't go to the Stick concept. There was at least 3 instances Wan'Dale was the backside #2 slanting to the Mike window. Mike went to the Stick, and he was wide open. Never went to him once. Given, I have no idea how they teach their progression, but that's how it works in my brain.

With Martinez they run a lot more 3 and 4 verts too, I think I saw 4 verts once w/ McCaff and he damn near threw a pick vs PSU & missed Wan'Dale breaking open on the hash.

I always enjoy talking football, hell I'm always trying to learn more. I'm way better than I was when I first started 16 years ago, but I still have a ton to learn.

I recall a lot of your posts when Scott was the OC at Oregon talking about how hard it would be for a DC to prepare for what Scott runs on one week. I can’t stand RSS anymore because so many of the takes lack any amount of nuance and I can’t imagine a world where I’m not looking for the answer to why something happened as opposed to just watching what happened and coming to a simple binary conclusion. Some of the mouth-breathing takes are just painful. I’m a fan that couldn’t stop asking himself why something happened the way it did and decided to try to understand.

I’m a soccer coach. Coached at the college level at IWCC. I was a coach there when Jake Waters was tossing the ball all over and you’d see every college come through and talk to him. As much as some football coaches don’t like hearing it, I draw so many comparisons and similarities to the two sports from a strategy perspective. Especially when it comes to route trees and concepts offensively to what you’re attempting to do in front of goal with soccer.
 
I'm really glad I'm on this board for this exact reason, I can ask much smarter people than me legit questions and get legit opinions without bullshit from other posters who I don't care to read from.

I think Moos's recent interview about Frost was spot on in continued support in the long run. I'm not an X's and O's guy. I'm a weight room and Husker Power guy. I know for a fact that they are better in that sense and that's a big enough deal as it is. Once that part is taken care of, getting there, it's just getting the schemes down and knowing what you're supposed to be doing at all times. I know that takes time.

If I could make a recommendation, I would tell you to go to FishDuck.com and watch some of the videos on what Oregon did during the Chip/Helfrich/Frost era. It’s done by a coach but for a fan like us as he doesn’t use the jargon that usually requires me to spend a day looking it up to understand. You’ll start to understand why we do what we do and why it’s a great offense. It’ll also show you what Frost has changed about what we do to fit what he wants.
 
If I could make a recommendation, I would tell you to go to FishDuck.com and watch some of the videos on what Oregon did during the Chip/Helfrich/Frost era. It’s done by a coach but for a fan like us as he doesn’t use the jargon that usually requires me to spend a day looking it up to understand. You’ll start to understand why we do what we do and why it’s a great offense. It’ll also show you what Frost has changed about what we do to fit what he wants.
I'll look at that, thank you!
 
I recall a lot of your posts when Scott was the OC at Oregon talking about how hard it would be for a DC to prepare for what Scott runs on one week. I can’t stand RSS anymore because so many of the takes lack any amount of nuance and I can’t imagine a world where I’m not looking for the answer to why something happened as opposed to just watching what happened and coming to a simple binary conclusion. Some of the mouth-breathing takes are just painful. I’m a fan that couldn’t stop asking himself why something happened the way it did and decided to try to understand.

I’m a soccer coach. Coached at the college level at IWCC. I was a coach there when Jake Waters was tossing the ball all over and you’d see every college come through and talk to him. As much as some football coaches don’t like hearing it, I draw so many comparisons and similarities to the two sports from a strategy perspective. Especially when it comes to route trees and concepts offensively to what you’re attempting to do in front of goal with soccer.
I played baseball at IWCC the same school year Waters was doing that, before he went to K-State. Went to some games. Kid was dominant at that level. Whole team was stupid dominant at that level. Honestly looked like our game against tOSU last year, every week for IWCC.
 
So at this point I value this board's opinion much more than RSS. I put this on twitter a few days ago but my follower/following twitter skills are weak, I'm proud of that, so didn't gain any traction. So wanted to ask this board since it's legit.....


In today's college football world, how would you guys like to see the old school playbook, that Osborne ran, and Frost ran as QB, run under Frost as the HC? Do you guys think he could teach it, run it effectively, get the right personnel in place, would it be effective in today's college football, can it be done at an elite level again?

Open discussion


I think yes and I think it'd be a super cool challenge to see in 2020 based on all the Spread Offenses.
I'm of the opinion that TO offense would've adapted to something similar to what Coastal Carolina ran.

Basically dive and dive option out of the gun. Rpo sprinkled in. I think the game and rules have changed too much to not do it. Jmo
 
You doing okay ?
Miss U GIF
 
I'm of the opinion that TO offense would've adapted to something similar to what Coastal Carolina ran.

Basically dive and dive option out of the gun. Rpo sprinkled in. I think the game and rules have changed too much to not do it. Jmo

There's definitely some Oz in there. I don't know how much they ever actually run much triple (just like us), but you have to pay attention to all the action in the backfield. They take it to another level since you don't know who is going to be the dive guy or the pitch guy. Would love to know how much stuff is predetermined/window dressing v. on-field decision / pre-snap RPO tag / real-time RPO, ect. Pretty crazy that they only had a guy go for >100 yards in three games last year.

Where they really fuck people up is getting everyone so caught up w/ everything going on in the backfield that they'll dunk all over people w/ the vertical shots in single coverage.
 
There's definitely some Oz in there. I don't know how much they ever actually run much triple (just like us), but you have to pay attention to all the action in the backfield. They take it to another level since you don't know who is going to be the dive guy or the pitch guy. Would love to know how much stuff is predetermined/window dressing v. on-field decision / pre-snap RPO tag / real-time RPO, ect. Pretty crazy that they only had a guy go for >100 yards in three games last year.

Where they really fuck people up is getting everyone so caught up w/ everything going on in the backfield that they'll dunk all over people w/ the vertical shots in single coverage.
Coastal Carolina is a flexbone team disguised as a spread team. They run a ton of belly and mid triple. They'll mix some other spread concepts as well. But you can tell by what they run the majority of the time, it's flexbone based.
 
Coastal Carolina is a flexbone team disguised as a spread team. They run a ton of belly and mid triple. They'll mix some other spread concepts as well. But you can tell by what they run the majority of the time, it's flexbone based.
They're one of my favorite schemes to follow.

I also like the coaches with questionable character crew... Sark, Kiffin and Freeze
 
I'm of the opinion that TO offense would've adapted to something similar to what Coastal Carolina ran.

Basically dive and dive option out of the gun. Rpo sprinkled in. I think the game and rules have changed too much to not do it. Jmo
Based on reading the tea leaves this off-season and the pistol concept, do you see us running more of that stuff this year? I have to think yes but that’s more hope than anything
 
Based on reading the tea leaves this off-season and the pistol concept, do you see us running more of that stuff this year? I have to think yes but that’s more hope than anything
Being in the pistol more has nothing to do with what CC does. But I have heard through a reliable source the staff met with another college staff that is well versed in spread option concepts/triple style football.
 
Being in the pistol more has nothing to do with what CC does. But I have heard through a reliable source the staff met with another college staff that is well versed in spread option concepts/triple style football.
this is interesting
 
I'd love for us to run some triple option out of the gun. That way we could get guys like Morrison on the field alongside Steppe. Or you could put Nixon or Alante back there and get then some carries.
 
Being in the pistol more has nothing to do with what CC does. But I have heard through a reliable source the staff met with another college staff that is well versed in spread option concepts/triple style football.

Yeah, not sure I agree with this. I know that CC implemented a lot more pistol stuff this last year and their staff credits that for being able to include more RPO stuff and to improve their running game (since you're not giving info away pre-snap). A big part of what Coastal bases its scheme around is speed option and a lot of what they're doing w/ their backfield action is trying to give extra time for blockers to get on their guy. I'm sure there is some true triple stuff that they run, but I think a lot of it is window dressing. Don't know that anyone outside of the CCU offense knows how much of their offense is fake dive action, true triple, and RPO, and that's by design.

Some good info on it here if you have a subscription. https://theathletic.com/2410223/202...-by-storm-analyzing-the-chanticleers-offense/
 
And in case you don't

“This is our first year of running it from the pistol,” Korn explained. “In 2019 and before, it was all both guys being offset. And we went to the pistol for a couple of reasons, and now I don’t know if I’ll ever go back. I love it so much just because you get so much extra ride time for your quarterback in the run game and you get so much ride time for your quarterback in the RPO game, and that’s where we took our next step from ’19 to ’20. Our RPOs were so much better because you get that extra ride time for the quarterback.”
 
Yeah, not sure I agree with this. I know that CC implemented a lot more pistol stuff this last year and their staff credits that for being able to include more RPO stuff and to improve their running game (since you're not giving info away pre-snap). A big part of what Coastal bases its scheme around is speed option and a lot of what they're doing w/ their backfield action is trying to give extra time for blockers to get on their guy. I'm sure there is some true triple stuff that they run, but I think a lot of it is window dressing. Don't know that anyone outside of the CCU offense knows how much of their offense is fake dive action, true triple, and RPO, and that's by design.

Some good info on it here if you have a subscription. https://theathletic.com/2410223/202...-by-storm-analyzing-the-chanticleers-offense/
You can watch who they read and who is unblocked to determine if it's window dressing or not. There's "some" true triple....There is a lot. They're the only team that arc releases their tackles when they run mid triple. A big part of their scheme is belly g and belly c with how good their C is, and mid triple. I don't care what the athletic says in basing their offense around speed option...that just isn't true. CC's coach has a background in the flexbone, and you can tell watching them play.
And in case you don't

“This is our first year of running it from the pistol,” Korn explained. “In 2019 and before, it was all both guys being offset. And we went to the pistol for a couple of reasons, and now I don’t know if I’ll ever go back. I love it so much just because you get so much extra ride time for your quarterback in the run game and you get so much ride time for your quarterback in the RPO game, and that’s where we took our next step from ’19 to ’20. Our RPOs were so much better because you get that extra ride time for the quarterback.”
That's fine in the RPO game. As I mentioned, they're basically a flexbone team from the spread and mix in RPO concepts.
 

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