TPB X thread

[Bootleg11]

this team is such a statistical anomaly it is exhausting

It is truly insane. When people tell you that special teams don't matter. They need to look no further than this distastrous season.

 

[Jim14510]

Clicked in here to post this. Incredible.

 

[Kaladin]

Yeah, the prosecutor has been pretty terrible. But Rittenhouse is an idiot and caused his own problem. It's a ridiculous standard if a 17-year-old kid can run into a crowd with an AR, freak people out and have them react to it, and then shoot them because he fears for his safety. Worse since the next two shootings were people responding to what they reasonably perceived to be an active shooter. The rape analogy works if someone had was wearing a "rape me" t-shirt, and then proceeded to rape their would-be attackers.

It’s interesting how you frame Rittenhouse as the aggressor and responsible party, and not the gang of criminals (they all had criminal histories) who were rioting and burning and looting that night and who chased Rittenhouse and surrounded him. Not only that, but you claim that they were responding to an active shooter situation, which is absurd given the circumstances, and which is an attempt by you to frame them has as the good guys, which is even more interesting.

 

[vailhusker]

 

[Jim14510]

It’s interesting how you frame Rittenhouse as the aggressor and responsible party, and not the gang of criminals (they all had criminal histories) who were rioting and burning and looting that night and who chased Rittenhouse and surrounded him. Not only that, but you claim that they were responding to an active shooter situation, which is absurd given the circumstances, and which is an attempt by you to frame them has as the good guys, which is even more interesting.

I mostly agree with you but there's no reason that kid should have been in that situation. Was talking to someone today about it. For me it makes a difference if he drove to check on dad/grandma and ended up on the street or if he drove there just to insert himself into the idiocy.

 

[Alcaus]

I mostly agree with you but there's no reason that kid should have been in that situation. Was talking to someone today about it. For me it makes a difference if he drove to check on dad/grandma and ended up on the street or if he drove there just to insert himself into the idiocy.

It’s irrelevant unless it can be proved he went there to kill people.

 

[Jim14510]

It’s irrelevant unless it can be proved he went there to kill people.

I don't mean in a legal sense. More just level of idiocy.

 

[Faux Sean Callahan]

 

[Faux Sean Callahan]

It is truly insane. When people tell you that special teams don't matter. They need to look no further than this distastrous season.

If we had a decent OL and our All B1G Kicker physically/mentally right this year would be completely different.

 

[Faux Sean Callahan]

Clicked in here to post this. Incredible.

Here are some more fucking dumb analytics







This one is interesting. Basically says analytically we should be an 8 win team. FPI had the "average top 5 team" winning 9 games with our schedule preseason before MSU became a top 10 team too.

 

[Faux Sean Callahan]

 

[22*43*51]

I mostly agree with you but there's no reason that kid should have been in that situation. Was talking to someone today about it. For me it makes a difference if he drove to check on dad/grandma and ended up on the street or if he drove there just to insert himself into the idiocy.

Natural cause/effect to the mayor and police chief letting the mob overrun the streets. If you’re going to find no fault with the mob, then you can’t fault those trying to defend the community.

 

[22*43*51]

 

[Mavsker]

1. The group out in Kenosha is a they not an it, so you can't apply a singular motivation or set of actions. Some were there to protest. Some there to riot. Some to take advantage of a situation and cause anarchy and raise hell. Some there to help. I don't don't where any of the 4+ people Rittenhouse fit in, Rittenhouse didn't/doesn't know where those fit in. No one really does.

2. Generally speaking at common law, there isn't a privilege to use deadly force in the protection of property, let alone someone else's property (incl. WI law). Which is important because..

3. The dude was fucking pointing an AR-15 at people (not just based on testimony--based on footage). Sure, dude had a right to open carry, but you cross a line when you point a gun at a crowd. It's not like there were a bunch of democrats bullying him because he said he was a Trump supporter or whatever weird scenario people have concocted. There were plenty of people with guns in that crowd (incl. one of the victims). The guy pointing guns at people is the one who caused problems. Pretty simple. Funny how that works. By the defense's logic, everyone was justified in coming after Rittenhouse for him brandishing his gun at them. Do we just have some self-defense shuttle-docking with whoever wins coming out on top? It's fucking incoherent.

4. Yeah, dude with skateboard tried to disarm Rittenhouse b/c he just fucking shot someone. Dude tried to jump kick him...b/c he just fucking shot someone. After seeing 3 people get shot at, Grosskreutz testified that he thought he was dealing w/ an active shooter, and was trying to neutralize that threat. He didn't see anything that happened with the first shooting. He went into the area b/c he heard gunshots. Looks like dude had a clear headshot, decided not to take it, and tried to de-escalate the situation. His hands were raised when Rittenhouse shot him. 2A advocate who tries to neutralize someone who just shot at 3 people and killed 2 sounds more like a republican fever dream for open carry, so not sure why that dude just gets thrown under the bus here.

5. Which is all to say, it's super fucking weird this kid is getting as much love as he is. Rittenhouse is a retard who was cosplaying as batman, had no fucking clue what he was doing in the situation, no clue about gun safety, and no clue about the capabilities of his weapon. It's like this was designed in a lab as an example for people advocating against open carry laws b/c in every situation dude's gun made this situation worse. 2 people are dead and one maimed b/c Rittenhouse didn't know what the fuck he was doing. I don't know bro, "I had to shoot them b/c I was afraid they would take away the gun strapped to my body and hurt me after I pointed it at them," isn't doing much for me on this one.

 

[Alcaus]

I don't mean in a legal sense. More just level of idiocy.

Yeah, I probably wouldn’t be out there but then again, if it’s my community maybe I would be.

If I had a 17 yo he would definitely not be out there.

 

[Kaladin]

1. The group out in Kenosha is a they not an it, so you can't apply a singular motivation or set of actions. Some were there to protest. Some there to riot. Some to take advantage of a situation and cause anarchy and raise hell. Some there to help. I don't don't where any of the 4+ people Rittenhouse fit in, Rittenhouse didn't/doesn't know where those fit in. No one really does.

2. Generally speaking at common law, there isn't a privilege to use deadly force in the protection of property, let alone someone else's property (incl. WI law). Which is important because..

3. The dude was fucking pointing an AR-15 at people (not just based on testimony--based on footage). Sure, dude had a right to open carry, but you cross a line when you point a gun at a crowd. It's not like there were a bunch of democrats bullying him because he said he was a Trump supporter or whatever weird scenario people have concocted. There were plenty of people with guns in that crowd (incl. one of the victims). The guy pointing guns at people is the one who caused problems. Pretty simple. Funny how that works. By the defense's logic, everyone was justified in coming after Rittenhouse for him brandishing his gun at them. Do we just have some self-defense shuttle-docking with whoever wins coming out on top? It's fucking incoherent.

4. Yeah, dude with skateboard tried to disarm Rittenhouse b/c he just fucking shot someone. Dude tried to jump kick him...b/c he just fucking shot someone. After seeing 3 people get shot at, Grosskreutz testified that he thought he was dealing w/ an active shooter, and was trying to neutralize that threat. He didn't see anything that happened with the first shooting. He went into the area b/c he heard gunshots. Looks like dude had a clear headshot, decided not to take it, and tried to de-escalate the situation. His hands were raised when Rittenhouse shot him. 2A advocate who tries to neutralize someone who just shot at 3 people and killed 2 sounds more like a republican fever dream for open carry, so not sure why that dude just gets thrown under the bus here.

5. Which is all to say, it's super fucking weird this kid is getting as much love as he is. Rittenhouse is a retard who was cosplaying as batman, had no fucking clue what he was doing in the situation, no clue about gun safety, and no clue about the capabilities of his weapon. It's like this was designed in a lab as an example for people advocating against open carry laws b/c in every situation dude's gun made this situation worse. 2 people are dead and one maimed b/c Rittenhouse didn't know what the fuck he was doing. I don't know bro, "I had to shoot them b/c I was afraid they would take away the gun strapped to my body and hurt me after I pointed it at them," isn't doing much for me on this one.

1. Rittenhouse was giving first aid and extinguishing fires. The only evidence given at trial that Rittenhouse or the people in his group were pointing their guns at people was testimony given that a man in yellow pants jumped on a car and pointed a gun at them, and Rittenhouse and his group pointed their guns back at him.

2. Rittenhouse was trying to extinguish a fire when the pedophile, Rosenbaum, and his friend Ziminski, who was illegally carrying a handgun, jumped out from behind a car and advanced towards Rittenhouse, with the handgun raised. Rittenhouse ran and they chased after him. Ziminski fired a shot in the air, Rittenhouse turned and pointed his gun at Rosenbaum, then Rittenhouse turned and ran again, Rosenbaum yelled "fuck you," Rittenhouse turned to face him again, and then Rosenbaum lunged for Rittenhouse gun, at which point Rittenhouse shot Rosenbaum.

3. The mob then chased Rittenhouse, who was going to the police. There is no video or testimony suggesting that Rittenhouse was pointing his gun at anyone until after the mob had surrounded him and begun attacking him. Rittenhouse was stunned by a blow, then falls down, then jumpkick man (a criminal) kicks him in the head with a booted foot. Rittenhouse fires at jumpkick man who runs away.

4. Then Huber (a criminal) hits Rittenhouse over the head with a skateboard, which you claim was an attempt to "disarm," which is a funny way to classify a violent blow to the head. Rittenhouse shoots Huber and kills him.

5. Kyle points his weapon at another pursuer who was advancing on him That pursuer then backs off.

6. Then Grosskruetz (who was carrying a handgun illegally because he had a felony charge) runs up to Rittenhouse. Rittenhouse points his gun at him, Grosskruetz throws his hands up, Rittenhouse does not fire. Rittenhouse lowers the barrel of his gun, so Grosskruetz aims his gun at Rittenhouse, who raises then raises his gun and fires. Grosskruetz lied to the police about the gun he was carrying, and is now suing the city. Your claim that Grosskruetz had his hands raised when Rittenhouse shot him is not what Grosskruetz testified to at trial, so where you're getting that claim is strange to say the least. Did you even listen to Grosskruetz testimony? Or do you just get your information from fucking Rachel Maddow?

7. Kyle then goes to the police.

8. The only proactive thing Rittenhouse did the entire night was go to the riots, which was reactive in itself. Everything else that happened to him, was him responding to the people who were attempting to attack him. Rosenbaum was the initial aggressor, Huber tried to bash his head in with a skateboard, and Grosskruetz pointed his gun at Rittenhouse after Rittenhouse had disengaged.

9. It's super fucking weird that people are trying to make Grosskruetz, Rosenbaum, and Huber into heroic figures. Not to mention jumpkick man. They even labeled Grosskruetz as the "lone survivor." All criminals.

10. Once again, it's super fucking weird that you claim Grosskruetz had his hands up when Rittenhouse shot him. Because that's not what Grosskruetz testified to. It's almost as if you aren't actually aware of the evidence that was presented at trial. It's almost as if you presumed Rittenhouse guilty from the start, and you're just making shit up to fit the narrative that you want to believe. Funny how that works.

 

[Alcaus]

^Like I said, there's video of Rittenhouse pointing his gun at the group (incl. Rosenbaum). It's not an item based on testimony. It's a major evidentiary issue in the case, and contradicted Rittenhouse's testimony. It's probably the biggest item in determining the case outcome rn. We don't get Rosenbaum's perspective. He may have been just been a total chaos actor. He may have been trying to disarm a guy who just pointed a gun at him. I think it's pretty dumb as an unarmed dude to try and take away a gun from someone who is armed. What do people think plausibly happened here? He's just some Boy Scout putting out fires when oopsies he just happens to point a gun and some people, and aw shucks, they get mad and chase him and, oh gee, he's just forced to shoot him four times? If Rittenhouse is justified in shooting Grosskruetz, doesn't Rosenbaum has just as much a claim to self-defense against the dude who was pointing an AR at him?

You talking about that grainy-ass drone footage or something else?

Rosenbaum threatened to kill him if he got him alone that night according to testimony. The dude was clearly unstable. He had been released from a mental hospital that day after being committed for a suicide attempt. Rosenbaum's fiance testified that he was depressed & bipolar and hadn't gotten his medication because the pharmacy was closed due to the unrest.

 

[Tell_Sackett]

1. Rittenhouse was giving first aid and extinguishing fires. The only evidence given at trial that Rittenhouse or the people in his group were pointing their guns at people was testimony given that a man in yellow pants jumped on a car and pointed a gun at them, and Rittenhouse and his group pointed their guns back at him.

2. Rittenhouse was trying to extinguish a fire when the pedophile, Rosenbaum, and his friend Ziminski, who was illegally carrying a handgun, jumped out from behind a car and advanced towards Rittenhouse, with the handgun raised. Rittenhouse ran and they chased after him. Ziminski fired a shot in the air, Rittenhouse turned and pointed his gun at Rosenbaum, then Rittenhouse turned and ran again, Rosenbaum yelled "fuck you," Rittenhouse turned to face him again, and then Rosenbaum lunged for Rittenhouse gun, at which point Rittenhouse shot Rosenbaum.

3. The mob then chased Rittenhouse, who was going to the police. There is no video or testimony suggesting that Rittenhouse was pointing his gun at anyone until after the mob had surrounded him and begun attacking him. Rittenhouse was stunned by a blow, then falls down, then jumpkick man (a criminal) kicks him in the head with a booted foot. Rittenhouse fires at jumpkick man who runs away.

4. Then Huber (a criminal) hits Rittenhouse over the head with a skateboard, which you claim was an attempt to "disarm," which is a funny way to classify a violent blow to the head. Rittenhouse shoots Huber and kills him.

5. Kyle points his weapon at another pursuer who was advancing on him That pursuer then backs off.

6. Then Grosskruetz (who was carrying a handgun illegally because he had a felony charge) runs up to Rittenhouse. Rittenhouse points his gun at him, Grosskruetz throws his hands up, Rittenhouse does not fire. Rittenhouse lowers the barrel of his gun, so Grosskruetz aims his gun at Rittenhouse, who raises then raises his gun and fires. Grosskruetz lied to the police about the gun he was carrying, and is now suing the city. Your claim that Grosskruetz had his hands raised when Rittenhouse shot him is not what Grosskruetz testified to at trial, so where you're getting that claim is strange to say the least. Did you even listen to Grosskruetz testimony? Or do you just get your information from fucking Rachel Maddow?

7. Kyle then goes to the police.

8. The only proactive thing Rittenhouse did the entire night was go to the riots, which was reactive in itself. Everything else that happened to him, was him responding to the people who were attempting to attack him. Rosenbaum was the initial aggressor, Huber tried to bash his head in with a skateboard, and Grosskruetz pointed his gun at Rittenhouse after Rittenhouse had disengaged.

9. It's super fucking weird that people are trying to make Grosskruetz, Rosenbaum, and Huber into heroic figures. Not to mention jumpkick man. They even labeled Grosskruetz as the "lone survivor." All criminals.

10. Once again, it's super fucking weird that you claim Grosskruetz had his hands up when Rittenhouse shot him. Because that's not what Grosskruetz testified to. It's almost as if you aren't actually aware of the evidence that was presented at trial. It's almost as if you presumed Rittenhouse guilty from the start, and you're just making shit up to fit the narrative that you want to believe. Funny how that works.

Points 5 and 6 tell me that, while we can all question his judgment of being there in the first place, he used more restraint under duress than most. I'm not sure I would have shown that level of trigger restraint at 17 in the heat of the moment.

 

[KidsSeeGhosts]

You talking about that grainy-ass drone footage or something else?

Rosenbaum threatened to kill him if he got him alone that night according to testimony. The dude was clearly unstable. He had been released from a mental hospital that day after being committed for a suicide attempt. Rosenbaum's fiance testified that he was depressed & bipolar and hadn't gotten his medication because the pharmacy was closed due to the unrest.

There's actually pretty good drone footage that was shown by the prosecution in closing arguments. That's the whole thing w/ the mistrial motion. The Rosenbaum mental illness stuff, while good lawyering, to me is just bait to the jury in a self-defense because Rittenhouse didn't know about it. If he testified that he knew Rosenbaum's bipolar background, maybe it's a factor, but doesn't matter for the actual facts of the case.

 

[Kaladin]

^Like I said, there's video of Rittenhouse pointing his gun at the group (incl. Rosenbaum). It's not an item based on testimony. It's a major evidentiary issue in the case, and contradicted Rittenhouse's testimony. It's probably the biggest item in determining the case outcome rn. We don't get Rosenbaum's perspective. He may have been just been a total chaos actor. He may have been trying to disarm a guy who just pointed a gun at him. I think it's pretty dumb as an unarmed dude to try and take away a gun from someone who is armed. What do people think plausibly happened here? He's just some Boy Scout putting out fires when oopsies he just happens to point a gun and some people, and aw shucks, they get mad and chase him and, oh gee, he's just forced to shoot him four times? If Rittenhouse is justified in shooting Grosskruetz, doesn't Rosenbaum has just as much a claim to self-defense against the dude who was pointing an AR at him?

Look dude, it's pretty clear what your bias in this situation is when you're labeling jump kick man, someone who is completely unidentified and we have no knowledge of what he did or did not do that night other than try and kick someone who had just killed someone. If your logic is "he's in Kenosha so he's a criminal" that's just a low IQ take. So's Rittenhouse.

Similarly, what's really weird is the rush to minimize the other people who died that night. But while you dismiss the whole "active shooter thing" 1. Rittenhouse is literally on trial for the Rosenbaum event, whether or not Huber and Grosskruetz tried to neutralize a murderer is something currently up for jury discussion and 2. There's significant debate about what happened w/ the benefit of drone footage and hours of testimony. All of these figures don't have the benefit of that. Huber, Grosskruetz, et. al were acting reasonably within the context of a chaotic situation where all they knew was people were getting shot. Like legitimately what are you expecting here, that they should just hear those gunshots, and think "man, those must be freedom bullets from a patriot honorably putting out fires and providing untrained medical care, nothing to see here!" Unlike the internet hot takes, they don't know who the fuck Rittenhouse was, who Rosenbaum was, or what exactly happened. Weird fucking behavior to minimize their lives in light of the circumstances they were in because of your politics.

Feel free to watch the video again. https://nypost.com/2020/08/28/alleged-kenosha-shooters-lawyer-claims-self-defense-amid-new-video/

Grosskruetz, a guy who wasn't even in the area when the original shooting happened, heard gun shots, and saw Rittenhouse shoot at two other people (one of which is killed). Dude could have taken out Rittenhouse from a distance several times here, chose not to do so. Rittenhouse pulls a gun on him with his arms raised. Dude testified that Rittenhouse reracked his weapon, and he was trying to non-lethally disarm him. I don't know if that's true. I do know that only one person in this situation tried to de-escalate by giving a universal surrender signal. I do know it seems a little implausible that if I'm actually going to shoot someone, rather than taking an open shot when their barrel is down, I would instead try to do some TACTICAL MOVE and move in for head shot or someone bullshit like that. I would say that I have a pretty reasonable right towards self-defense regardless when I know at least 2 other people have been shot, and there is a gun on me, but I guess you just give Rittenhouse a right to self-defense in these situations?

There were plenty of people armed that night. No one else killed anyone that night, but Rittenhouse. He recklessly brought a gun into a situation he wasn't trained to use, proceeded to use that gun recklessly, and caused a chain of unnecessary violence. Don't assume shit about my politics. I grew up in Wyoming. I've spent my entire life using guns. I've had to provide immediate first aid on a coworker who accidentally shot themselves cleaning a loaded gun. Responsible gun use isn't a fucking political issue.

1. Rosenbaum's meds were for schizo and paranoia and he hadn't taken them, per his fiance. People testified that Rosenbaum threatened to kill Rittenhouse and that Rosenbaum burned down a trailer. And it was Rosenbaum and his friend, who had a hand gun and had fired it, who chased Rittenhouse, not the other way around. It was testified that "if there was trouble in Kenosha that night, Rosenbaum was there."

2. Jumpkick man has been identified. His name is Maurice Freeland, and he has admitted to kicking Rittenhouse in the face. He is a career criminal who was out on bond.

3. You're showing your bias here with your "freedom bullets" bullshit. Rittenhouse was running to the police after he fired on Rosenbaum. Then the mob descended on him. "Acting reasonably" would be running away, not chasing down a person with a rifle and smashing a skateboard over his head while he lay on the ground. "Acting reasonably" would be to back away from the guy with the rifle pointed at you, not waiting for him to lower his gun, then pointing your handgun at him. And I don't have any issue with "minimizing their lives." Rosenbaum was a fucking pedophile. Huber and Grosskruetz chose to chase down Rittenhouse, and they're criminals as well.

4. Grosskruetz testified that Rittenhouse pointed the gun at him, then Grosskruetz put his hands up, at which point Rittenhouse lowered his gun. Which would be deescalation. Grosskruetz could have left it at that and ran away, like the other guy, but he didn't. He pointed his gun at Rittenhouse and escalated the situation.

5. Don't assume shit about my politics either. You're the one throwing "freedom bullets" bullshit out there.