Dylan Raiola: 13 forced DPI penalties through 5 games

[Jim14510]

Obviously this is so nitpicky considering what we’ve had at quarterback over the years. I think he’s incredible. This is just one part of his game that I haven’t understood up to this point. I guess this is more complimentary for the defense to do this as opposed to scoring in 1 play.

This is an important disclaimer. He's been incredible. Way better than expected and expectations were high. He's the best most important player on the team and it's not close.

 

[tman87]

That's not true. There have been several go routes where our WRs had 2 yds on their DB. Dylan's hit on a couple but the vast majority he has under thrown (some earning DPIs). And some others he just didn't see the WR.

Last 2 games especially we've probably had 10 plays where the receiver had 1-2 yds of separation and Dylan didn't see him or under threw him. He'll, Lindemeyer got 3 yds of separation and Dylan just missed him.

The narrative that "our receivers aren't getting separation" is dumb. It all comes from that UGA QB saying it after game 1 on that YT video. It hasn't been true lately. Dylan is just missing them.

Talk to someone that goes to the games and sits at a good viewpoint (E or W, high enough up) and they'll tell you our WRs and TES (Fidone) have been getting PLENTY of separation. Dylan has just missed them. It's OK, he's young, still getting timing right.

IMO - our receivers are not often getting great separation. They do some, no doubt, but not often enough where DR has a ton of confidence in them IMHO. And yes, the receivers have improved - you can't just be running 3/4 speed when your QB is throwing to a spot he expects you to be. This has made DR a bit more hesitant to unleash, I think. DR has thrown a good number of balls that the receivers didn't make the catch long - and I watch, then rewatch all of the games (OK, not the Illinois game yet). Even then, too often the edge receivers are not in the field of view of the camera to see everything. But I trust what I have seen from the entire picture of now 5 games for DR and our receivers.

I don't even disagree that DR needs to unleash more long. It stretches the defense for sure. I think as a true Frosh DR is playing things a bit more safe on a lot of these throws. And of course, some are simply just shorter than they should have been - name me a QB who always makes a perfect throw. And I don't think that is at all an arm strength issue. It is more his decision most of the time. He also is arm throwing a lot of these, not just fully stepping into it, because his arm is that strong - he can do those types of things most QB's can't.

I did expect more rainbow long bombs from DR. I think we all did. But I am not in a rush to hurry the process with him. He is already so far ahead of almost all true Frosh QB's. Certainly far ahead of any true Frosh (or any year) QB we have ever had as a passer. He has a feel, touch and accuracy to make really tough throws, accurately, and so far in 5 games, has done that a ton.

I expect to see more long bombs from him as the year progresses. But if defenses are trying to keep the top off of the offense, it isn't always the smartest to test that too much, either. It will come together even better than it has been for DR, our receivers and team. I believe that.

 

[HerbRedman]

IMO - our receivers are not often getting great separation. They do some, no doubt, but not often enough where DR has a ton of confidence in them IMHO. And yes, the receivers have improved - you can't just be running 3/4 speed when your QB is throwing to a spot he expects you to be. This has made DR a bit more hesitant to unleash, I think.

You might be right.

I was listening to Severe's show today and he actually had a caller call in to say the same thing "the WRs aren't getting separation."

Here was Severe's take on it:

 

[tman87]

You might be right.

I was listening to Severe's show today and he actually had a caller call in to say the same thing "the WRs aren't getting separation."

Here was Severe's take on it:

Like I said, there is better route running and separationg now than the first game or 2. It can and should still be better. And also, as I mentioned, I think DR does not have total confidence in just unleashing as there has been too much "not full speed enough" from some of the receivers (definitely not from Barney lol).

I do think DR is more comfortable with our receivers getting to their underneath spots better now. But then he was also pretty confident in that from game one, too. I would bet the coaches will continue to work on the deep ball. But I am not exactly complaining about how well the sticks move, either from non-bomb, over the top, catches, or DPI being called because our receivers are getting bonafide DPI's in their favor a lot. And most of it is because DR is so good at locating the ball outside and a bit behind.

BTW, I am not basing my opinion on listening to what others (in media, etc) say. It is really just what I see with my eyes so far.

Good link, thanks man.

 

[HerbRedman]

Good link, thanks man.

Tis all good my man. Only shared that because I heard it right after we were having this discussion.

TBF my buddy has been to all 4 home games and he has said the same thing as Severe - that in person you can see our WRs getting separation very frequently, especially in the last couple games. He says you can't see it as well on the TV broadcasts.


My theory is different: I think Dylan was so indoctrinated with the "turnovers are bad" computer programming that he is really shying away from "letting it loose." And he's taking a shit ton of the underneath routes. I think it's an overcorrection from last year's turnovers though...I think he's probably missed 3-4 50+ yd plays due to this.

It's great that he's taking care of the ball. That's the most important thing. But I think it's also OK to let loose and throw some Geno Torreta/Mark Rypien style bombs once in a while.

 

[COYS]

I do think there is a different perception when watching on tv. Great example if first drive against Purdue. I believe it was third down and Purdue only rushed three. Dylan had a ton of time and had to throw the ball away as nobody appeared to be open. Television showed our WR's all covered and none made any attempt to work themselves open.

 

[tman87]

Tis all good my man. Only shared that because I heard it right after we were having this discussion.

TBF my buddy has been to all 4 home games and he has said the same thing as Severe - that in person you can see our WRs getting separation very frequently, especially in the last couple games. He says you can't see it as well on the TV broadcasts.


My theory is different: I think Dylan was so indoctrinated with the "turnovers are bad" computer programming that he is really shying away from "letting it loose." And he's taking a shit ton of the underneath routes. I think it's an overcorrection from last year's turnovers though...I think he's probably missed 3-4 50+ yd plays due to this.

It's great that he's taking care of the ball. That's the most important thing. But I think it's also OK to let loose and throw some Geno Torreta/Mark Rypien style bombs once in a while.

Good stuff, and I actually think we are on the same page. "Turnovers are bad".... is true, and something DR is very cognizant of. And we finally have a QB who can not only take care of the ball better, but also do something with it past his first option read/progression. That is the beauty of it - DR can go through the progressions (and doesn't always make the best or right read, but also not the worst or wrong read/throw), and still get the ball consistently to a receiver for a completion. That kind of thing is really noticed by receivers, and it only bodes well for even more cohesiveness between DR and the receiver group. Also bodes well for continuing to recruit/portal in high level receiver corp guys yearly.

I am fine with DR being extra careful with the ball, especially early on in the season. And obviously early on in DR's career. He has shown so much as a QB who truly does things and sees things that NFL starting QB's do and see. Yes, he has had the advantage of the best coaching and support system growing up thanks to his fathers $ and connections, but it is obvious DR has not only utilized that advantage very well, but the kid is the type who is going to continue to learn, improve and advance his game. Plus, he has a ton of talent as a QB.

We are lucky to have this kid slinging the rock for us.

 

[...TrueColors...]

Good stuff, and I actually think we are on the same page. "Turnovers are bad".... is true, and something DR is very cognizant of. And we finally have a QB who can not only take care of the ball better, but also do something with it past his first option read/progression. That is the beauty of it - DR can go through the progressions (and doesn't always make the best or right read, but also not the worst or wrong read/throw), and still get the ball consistently to a receiver for a completion. That kind of thing is really noticed by receivers, and it only bodes well for even more cohesiveness between DR and the receiver group. Also bodes well for continuing to recruit/portal in high level receiver corp guys yearly.

I am fine with DR being extra careful with the ball, especially early on in the season. And obviously early on in DR's career. He has shown so much as a QB who truly does things and sees things that NFL starting QB's do and see. Yes, he has had the advantage of the best coaching and support system growing up thanks to his fathers $ and connections, but it is obvious DR has not only utilized that advantage very well, but the kid is the type who is going to continue to learn, improve and advance his game. Plus, he has a ton of talent as a QB.

We are lucky to have this kid slinging the rock for us.

To your point about getting past his first option, I agree wholeheartedly and I think an overlooked portion of Dylan’s game is his ability to get to 3 and 4 very quickly when he knows 1 and 2 aren’t there. Theres a lot of times he gets the ball to the back in space and we get a really good gain out of the deal.

Couple other things that are related:

1) very impressed with the improvement in pass pro from the OL. I haven’t seen @slattimer around in awhile and I hope that means he’s in the middle of a state championship run. But I’d love to hear his take to see if my eyes are lying to me or not. But from my eye, it looks like they’ve gotten better there and I’m really impressed with them not getting beaten by stunts.

2) There are times where we have had to utilize backs and TEs in pass pro. I’d like us not to have to do that much because it means one less guy in the route tree. I think against better teams up front it’ll cost us down the road.

 

[Minute Man]

It was hard to see on the shitty Peacock broadcast, but on at least 2 or 3 of those back shoulder throws, it was obvious there was safety help over the top.

 

[slattimer]

not getting beaten by stunts.

This is what I've noticed the most. Not a lot of straight line shots to the QB where protections were blown or not picking up twist games.

 

[skersker]

He can get the ball there, but TBH, our receivers are not usually getting a lot of separation.

Entirely untrue. If you’ve been to games in person you know this isn’t true.

Dylan either hits it for a completion, or doesn’t put the ball in harms way. There are plenty of plays with multiple guys who have separation.

 

[kenyanfeline]

That's not true. There have been several go routes where our WRs had 2 yds on their DB. Dylan's hit on a couple but the vast majority he has under thrown (some earning DPIs). And some others he just didn't see the WR.

Last 2 games especially we've probably had 10 plays where the receiver had 1-2 yds of separation and Dylan didn't see him or under threw him. He'll, Lindemeyer got 3 yds of separation and Dylan just missed him.

The narrative that "our receivers aren't getting separation" is dumb. It all comes from that UGA QB saying it after game 1 on that YT video. It hasn't been true lately. Dylan is just missing them.

Talk to someone that goes to the games and sits at a good viewpoint (E or W, high enough up) and they'll tell you our WRs and TES (Fidone) have been getting PLENTY of separation. Dylan has just missed them. It's OK, he's young, still getting timing right.

Maybe @lattimer can explain this better, but to my less trained eyes:

We’ve been seeing a shit ton of man cover 2 with 2 high safeties. On several of these “Underthrow to DPI plays”, there’s been separation between the receiver and the corner.

You could see it on the broadcast a couple times if you look at the replay.

Here, against Illinois, Banks actually has zero separation, plus there is a high safety. If he floats it to the end zone, the safety has a chance to catch up. He threw it to literally the only place Banks has a chance:
View attachment RPReplay_Final1727695094.mov


Here, against Purdue, Neyor does have a step of separation, but again, if Raiola floats it to the end zone, there’s a great chance the safety can catch up because they are in cover 2:

View attachment IMG_4042.mov

Again against Purdue. Cover 2 again. The reciever doesn’t get separation. Nothing open underneath. Raiola throws it just over the pylon and the defender is forced to get tangled up.


View attachment IMG_4043.mov

Finally, again against Purdue, they are showing 1 high safety. No separation. Dylan recognizes this and throws back shoulder. Unfortunately on this one, he was under pressure, because if he had another 1/2 second, he should have seen the safety commit to the far sideline leaving Lloyd wide open because Lloyd did get good separation here.

View attachment IMG_4045.mov

What I’m seeing is teams being super concerned about Raiola’s arm strength and playing a ton of cover 2. This leads to it being VERY risky to take shots downfield as there are 2 safeties patrolling the seams. Raiola is smart enough to recognize this and is consistently taking what the defense gives over the middle and in the flats, or he’s throwing back shoulder where the defender is forced to either give up a chunk play or commit DPI. I would guess that after teams watch the Purdue film, they may play with 1 high safety and being an additional blitzer. That’s going to open up the seams a little but also result in more pressure.

It’s awesome to see teams respect our QB’s arm enough for them to handcuff themselves.

If there’s one knock on Raiola, it’s that he has missed a couple guys deep and hasn’t see. Lloyd a couple times on a go route down the middle when both safeties have committed to the sideline.

 

[Baron Winnebago]

Maybe @lattimer can explain this better, but to my less trained eyes:

We’ve been seeing a shit ton of man cover 2 with 2 high safeties. On several of these “Underthrow to DPI plays”, there’s been separation between the receiver and the corner.

You could see it on the broadcast a couple times if you look at the replay.

Here, against Illinois, Banks actually has zero separation, plus there is a high safety. If he floats it to the end zone, the safety has a chance to catch up. He threw it to literally the only place Banks has a chance:
View attachment 42633


Here, against Purdoodoo, Neyor does have a step of separation, but again, if Raiola floats it to the end zone, there’s a great chance the safety can catch up because they are in cover 2:

View attachment 42634

Again against Purdoodoo. Cover 2 again. The reciever doesn’t get separation. Nothing open underneath. Raiola throws it just over the pylon and the defender is forced to get tangled up.


View attachment 42635

Finally, again against Purdoodoo, they are showing 1 high safety. No separation. Dylan recognizes this and throws back shoulder. Unfortunately on this one, he was under pressure, because if he had another 1/2 second, he should have seen the safety commit to the far sideline leaving Lloyd wide open because Lloyd did get good separation here.

View attachment 42636

What I’m seeing is teams being super concerned about Raiola’s arm strength and playing a ton of cover 2. This leads to it being VERY risky to take shots downfield as there are 2 safeties patrolling the seams. Raiola is smart enough to recognize this and is consistently taking what the defense gives over the middle and in the flats, or he’s throwing back shoulder where the defender is forced to either give up a chunk play or commit DPI. I would guess that after teams watch the Purdoodoo film, they may play with 1 high safety and being an additional blitzer. That’s going to open up the seams a little but also result in more pressure.

It’s awesome to see teams respect our QB’s arm enough for them to handcuff themselves.

If there’s one knock on Raiola, it’s that he has missed a couple guys deep and hasn’t see. Lloyd a couple times on a go route down the middle when both safeties have committed to the sideline.

The 3rd video juxtaposed (look it up Jim) with the other 3 illustrates the point really well I think. He went for it with Neyor who had separation even with the safety over the top and Purdue PIs anyways. Not a reluctance to throw the deep shot just reading where the safety is and making a decision to either put it in a place the help doesn't matter, back shoulder and short, or if he has the space to throw the guy open deep.

 

[BluesBucksNHuskers]

Btw, go back and watch the Ryan Williams catch everyone is talking about. That ball was “Underthrown” the exact same way.

 

[tman87]

To your point about getting past his first option, I agree wholeheartedly and I think an overlooked portion of Dylan’s game is his ability to get to 3 and 4 very quickly when he knows 1 and 2 aren’t there. Theres a lot of times he gets the ball to the back in space and we get a really good gain out of the deal.

Couple other things that are related:

1) very impressed with the improvement in pass pro from the OL. I haven’t seen @slattimer around in awhile and I hope that means he’s in the middle of a state championship run. But I’d love to hear his take to see if my eyes are lying to me or not. But from my eye, it looks like they’ve gotten better there and I’m really impressed with them not getting beaten by stunts.

2) There are times where we have had to utilize backs and TEs in pass pro. I’d like us not to have to do that much because it means one less guy in the route tree. I think against better teams up front it’ll cost us down the road.

Maybe @lattimer can explain this better, but to my less trained eyes:

We’ve been seeing a shit ton of man cover 2 with 2 high safeties. On several of these “Underthrow to DPI plays”, there’s been separation between the receiver and the corner.

You could see it on the broadcast a couple times if you look at the replay.

Here, against Illinois, Banks actually has zero separation, plus there is a high safety. If he floats it to the end zone, the safety has a chance to catch up. He threw it to literally the only place Banks has a chance:
View attachment 42633


Here, against Purdoodoo, Neyor does have a step of separation, but again, if Raiola floats it to the end zone, there’s a great chance the safety can catch up because they are in cover 2:

View attachment 42634

Again against Purdoodoo. Cover 2 again. The reciever doesn’t get separation. Nothing open underneath. Raiola throws it just over the pylon and the defender is forced to get tangled up.


View attachment 42635

Finally, again against Purdoodoo, they are showing 1 high safety. No separation. Dylan recognizes this and throws back shoulder. Unfortunately on this one, he was under pressure, because if he had another 1/2 second, he should have seen the safety commit to the far sideline leaving Lloyd wide open because Lloyd did get good separation here.

View attachment 42636

What I’m seeing is teams being super concerned about Raiola’s arm strength and playing a ton of cover 2. This leads to it being VERY risky to take shots downfield as there are 2 safeties patrolling the seams. Raiola is smart enough to recognize this and is consistently taking what the defense gives over the middle and in the flats, or he’s throwing back shoulder where the defender is forced to either give up a chunk play or commit DPI. I would guess that after teams watch the Purdoodoo film, they may play with 1 high safety and being an additional blitzer. That’s going to open up the seams a little but also result in more pressure.

It’s awesome to see teams respect our QB’s arm enough for them to handcuff themselves.

If there’s one knock on Raiola, it’s that he has missed a couple guys deep and hasn’t see. Lloyd a couple times on a go route down the middle when both safeties have committed to the sideline.

The 3rd video juxtaposed (look it up Jim) with the other 3 illustrates the point really well I think. He went for it with Neyor who had separation even with the safety over the top and Purdoodoo PIs anyways. Not a reluctance to throw the deep shot just reading where the safety is and making a decision to either put it in a place the help doesn't matter, back shoulder and short, or if he has the space to throw the guy open deep.

Good stuff on all of this. Agree with it all.

DR is being very smart most of the time in his decisions on where to throw the ball. This is a big reason he only has two picks, and both of those picks were skin of the teeth kind of picks where our receiver just got the ball taken away by excellent plays by the defenders.

DR is playing at a very high level, and especially for a true frosh.

 

[slattimer]

Maybe @lattimer can explain this better, but to my less trained eyes:

We’ve been seeing a shit ton of man cover 2 with 2 high safeties. On several of these “Underthrow to DPI plays”, there’s been separation between the receiver and the corner.

You could see it on the broadcast a couple times if you look at the replay.

Here, against Illinois, Banks actually has zero separation, plus there is a high safety. If he floats it to the end zone, the safety has a chance to catch up. He threw it to literally the only place Banks has a chance:
View attachment 42633


Here, against Purdoodoo, Neyor does have a step of separation, but again, if Raiola floats it to the end zone, there’s a great chance the safety can catch up because they are in cover 2:

View attachment 42634

Again against Purdoodoo. Cover 2 again. The reciever doesn’t get separation. Nothing open underneath. Raiola throws it just over the pylon and the defender is forced to get tangled up.


View attachment 42635

Finally, again against Purdoodoo, they are showing 1 high safety. No separation. Dylan recognizes this and throws back shoulder. Unfortunately on this one, he was under pressure, because if he had another 1/2 second, he should have seen the safety commit to the far sideline leaving Lloyd wide open because Lloyd did get good separation here.

View attachment 42636

What I’m seeing is teams being super concerned about Raiola’s arm strength and playing a ton of cover 2. This leads to it being VERY risky to take shots downfield as there are 2 safeties patrolling the seams. Raiola is smart enough to recognize this and is consistently taking what the defense gives over the middle and in the flats, or he’s throwing back shoulder where the defender is forced to either give up a chunk play or commit DPI. I would guess that after teams watch the Purdoodoo film, they may play with 1 high safety and being an additional blitzer. That’s going to open up the seams a little but also result in more pressure.

It’s awesome to see teams respect our QB’s arm enough for them to handcuff themselves.

If there’s one knock on Raiola, it’s that he has missed a couple guys deep and hasn’t see. Lloyd a couple times on a go route down the middle when both safeties have committed to the sideline.

Clips you showed are either 2 man or 1 rat IMO. 1st one is 1 Rat.

Seems like we need more man beaters, as that's what we're getting a lot of. DR throws those back shoulder routes well.

 

[Docbezoar]

But that Bama pick in the end zone that just ended the game is an example of how the under throw can fuck you

He had backed off and wasn’t running at full speed down the field