Driveway sealing

[Dr.DrakeRamoray]

New home finished in February, builder mentioned sealing the driveway is a good idea. Everyone I’ve asked around has said they have never sealed theirs. FIL specifically said he’s never done it his concrete is 25 years old and looks perfectly fine. Anyone have any experience with it or done it before? Pros? Cons?

Spoiler: For your help

 

[greybeardedchild]

I know a few things about concrete, let me help.

We never used to seal exterior concrete unless it was decorative (stamped/stained). There is 30 yr old concrete out there that looks fine. However, this new 1L mix bullshit that they have been pushing the last few years, along with increasing amounts of flyash in the mix, has changed the game for the worse. I don't actually know if the concrete mix is weaker, I mean they still have to hit their strength requirements on tested jobs. However, on residential stuff, crews are having a tough time adapting to the new mix. It is really sticky and hard to work with for one, which makes crews want to pour it wet, which degrades the surface strength specifically. (Also the strength of the whole mix, but that shouldn't typically matter for your driveway unless they poured it as thin as possible). Some crews lacking in common sense will also sprinkle water on top of the concrete while finishing. (hit it with the holy water, they call it) While that certainly makes it look good initially, that greatly weakens the surface and gives a great chance for surface peeling and delamination. Lastly, crews that are used to finishing with a steel trowel or Fresno, because that's how they did it for the last 50 years, well that is not workable anymore. Every piece of exterior concrete with the new 1L Mix that I've seen finished with steel has started to surface peel. Especially worse on a driveway where there is lots of freeze/thaw of material being dragged up with your tires etc. So now, you have to finish with bull float and broom to have a durable surface, but some haven't caught on yet and are still dodging callbacks from stuff they poured in the last few years.
So, if you have a driveway poured within the last few years, and it isn't a little bit rough (light broom finished) it is a matter of time until it starts peeling, especially if it was poured by the low bidder. Sealer can definitely help by keeping water from seeping into the concrete, freezing, and popping off the top layer. Also need to seal the joints with SL1 to really do it right. I would personally seal any amount of new concrete poured, especially if you are a fan of snowmelt. Snowmelt is a big no-go on new concrete for the first several years as it gets seasoned. It's slightly ok to use it on sealer concrete.
All this only applies to concrete in freeze-prone areas.

 

[Dr.DrakeRamoray]

I know a few things about concrete, let me help.

We never used to seal exterior concrete unless it was decorative (stamped/stained). There is 30 yr old concrete out there that looks fine. However, this new 1L mix bullshit that they have been pushing the last few years, along with increasing amounts of flyash in the mix, has changed the game for the worse. I don't actually know if the concrete mix is weaker, I mean they still have to hit their strength requirements on tested jobs. However, on residential stuff, crews are having a tough time adapting to the new mix. It is really sticky and hard to work with for one, which makes crews want to pour it wet, which degrades the surface strength specifically. (Also the strength of the whole mix, but that shouldn't typically matter for your driveway unless they poured it as thin as possible). Some crews lacking in common sense will also sprinkle water on top of the concrete while finishing. (hit it with the holy water, they call it) While that certainly makes it look good initially, that greatly weakens the surface and gives a great chance for surface peeling and delamination. Lastly, crews that are used to finishing with a steel trowel or Fresno, because that's how they did it for the last 50 years, well that is not workable anymore. Every piece of exterior concrete with the new 1L Mix that I've seen finished with steel has started to surface peel. Especially worse on a driveway where there is lots of freeze/thaw of material being dragged up with your tires etc. So now, you have to finish with bull float and broom to have a durable surface, but some haven't caught on yet and are still dodging callbacks from stuff they poured in the last few years.
So, if you have a driveway poured within the last few years, and it isn't a little bit rough (light broom finished) it is a matter of time until it starts peeling, especially if it was poured by the low bidder. Sealer can definitely help by keeping water from seeping into the concrete, freezing, and popping off the top layer. Also need to seal the joints with SL1 to really do it right. I would personally seal any amount of new concrete poured, especially if you are a fan of snowmelt. Snowmelt is a big no-go on new concrete for the first several years as it gets seasoned. It's slightly ok to use it on sealer concrete.
All this only applies to concrete in freeze-prone areas.

Given the nightly temps we are seeing in Omaha doesn’t make sense to seal now or in the late spring? Lots of things I’ve seen say temps should be beaten 50-90 for 48 hours, we are getting under that nightly here

 

[Cash68847]

New home finished in February, builder mentioned sealing the driveway is a good idea. Everyone I’ve asked around has said they have never sealed theirs. FIL specifically said he’s never done it his concrete is 25 years old and looks perfectly fine. Anyone have any experience with it or done it before? Pros? Cons?

Spoiler: For your help

View attachment 60828

I sealed my new driveway with aquapel because I didn’t want salt to screw it up. You can roll it on even and it won’t turn milky. You won’t even know you sealed it when you’re done. The only time you can tell is where it rains and beads up. I would not put a decorative sealer on a driveway myself.

 

[Dr.DrakeRamoray]

I know a few things about concrete, let me help.

We never used to seal exterior concrete unless it was decorative (stamped/stained). There is 30 yr old concrete out there that looks fine. However, this new 1L mix bullshit that they have been pushing the last few years, along with increasing amounts of flyash in the mix, has changed the game for the worse. I don't actually know if the concrete mix is weaker, I mean they still have to hit their strength requirements on tested jobs. However, on residential stuff, crews are having a tough time adapting to the new mix. It is really sticky and hard to work with for one, which makes crews want to pour it wet, which degrades the surface strength specifically. (Also the strength of the whole mix, but that shouldn't typically matter for your driveway unless they poured it as thin as possible). Some crews lacking in common sense will also sprinkle water on top of the concrete while finishing. (hit it with the holy water, they call it) While that certainly makes it look good initially, that greatly weakens the surface and gives a great chance for surface peeling and delamination. Lastly, crews that are used to finishing with a steel trowel or Fresno, because that's how they did it for the last 50 years, well that is not workable anymore. Every piece of exterior concrete with the new 1L Mix that I've seen finished with steel has started to surface peel. Especially worse on a driveway where there is lots of freeze/thaw of material being dragged up with your tires etc. So now, you have to finish with bull float and broom to have a durable surface, but some haven't caught on yet and are still dodging callbacks from stuff they poured in the last few years.
So, if you have a driveway poured within the last few years, and it isn't a little bit rough (light broom finished) it is a matter of time until it starts peeling, especially if it was poured by the low bidder. Sealer can definitely help by keeping water from seeping into the concrete, freezing, and popping off the top layer. Also need to seal the joints with SL1 to really do it right. I would personally seal any amount of new concrete poured, especially if you are a fan of snowmelt. Snowmelt is a big no-go on new concrete for the first several years as it gets seasoned. It's slightly ok to use it on sealer concrete.
All this only applies to concrete in freeze-prone areas.

Also seal the control joints with SL1 or should just be sealing the expansion joints? I’ve seen countering opinions online

 

[Cash68847]

Also seal the control joints with SL1 or should just be sealing the expansion joints? I’ve seen countering opinions online

They seal the expansions on commercial jobs.

 

[Dr.DrakeRamoray]

They seal the expansions on commercial jobs.

I plan on doing the expansion joints, that’s my Sunday project this week

 

[Cash68847]

I plan on doing the expansion joints, that’s my Sunday project this week

I caulked everything besides some expansion. I need to do it. You already pretty much have backer rod if you cut it out a little. I used some dow Corning stuff on my driveway. It’s probably the equivalent to what has been mentioned on here

 

[Dr.DrakeRamoray]

I caulked everything besides some expansion. I need to do it. You already pretty much have backer rod if you cut it out a little. I used some dow Corning stuff on my driveway. It’s probably the equivalent to what has been mentioned on here

The control joints on my driveway are so narrow it’s going to be a pain in the dick to do those

 

[greybeardedchild]

I know a few things about concrete, let me help.

We never used to seal exterior concrete unless it was decorative (stamped/stained). There is 30 yr old concrete out there that looks fine. However, this new 1L mix bullshit that they have been pushing the last few years, along with increasing amounts of flyash in the mix, has changed the game for the worse. I don't actually know if the concrete mix is weaker, I mean they still have to hit their strength requirements on tested jobs. However, on residential stuff, crews are having a tough time adapting to the new mix. It is really sticky and hard to work with for one, which makes crews want to pour it wet, which degrades the surface strength specifically. (Also the strength of the whole mix, but that shouldn't typically matter for your driveway unless they poured it as thin as possible). Some crews lacking in common sense will also sprinkle water on top of the concrete while finishing. (hit it with the holy water, they call it) While that certainly makes it look good initially, that greatly weakens the surface and gives a great chance for surface peeling and delamination. Lastly, crews that are used to finishing with a steel trowel or Fresno, because that's how they did it for the last 50 years, well that is not workable anymore. Every piece of exterior concrete with the new 1L Mix that I've seen finished with steel has started to surface peel. Especially worse on a driveway where there is lots of freeze/thaw of material being dragged up with your tires etc. So now, you have to finish with bull float and broom to have a durable surface, but some haven't caught on yet and are still dodging callbacks from stuff they poured in the last few years.
So, if you have a driveway poured within the last few years, and it isn't a little bit rough (light broom finished) it is a matter of time until it starts peeling, especially if it was poured by the low bidder. Sealer can definitely help by keeping water from seeping into the concrete, freezing, and popping off the top layer. Also need to seal the joints with SL1 to really do it right. I would personally seal any amount of new concrete poured, especially if you are a fan of snowmelt. Snowmelt is a big no-go on new concrete for the first several years as it gets seasoned. It's slightly ok to use it on sealer concrete.
All this only applies to concrete in freeze-prone areas.

Sorry I got so wordy. TLDR
If you have great looking, smooth exterior concrete, it will probably not hold up in freeze/thaw conditions because the new mix is shittier. Unfortunately, durable exterior concrete will not look as nice and hard troweled as it use to, because that process takes away the surface strength. Residential concrete crews are still needing to adapt to the new finishing techniques to make this new mix work, and lots that I have seen havent adapted yet. Also, snowmelt, even ones claiming to be concrete safe, are hell on new concrete, due to the process of snowmelt causing way more freeze/thaw cycles.

 

[Cash68847]

The control joints on my driveway are so narrow it’s going to be a pain in the dick to do those

I did self leveling on my old driveway. On my new I didn’t. You definitely need backer rod if you do self leveling. On new one I ran a small bead and tooled it with the butter knife tools you can get.

 

[Cash68847]

Sorry I got so wordy. TLDR
If you have great looking, smooth exterior concrete, it will probably not hold up in freeze/thaw conditions because the new mix is shittier. Unfortunately, durable exterior concrete will not look as nice and hard troweled as it use to, because that process takes away the surface strength. Residential concrete crews are still needing to adapt to the new finishing techniques to make this new mix work, and lots that I have seen havent adapted yet. Also, snowmelt, even ones claiming to be concrete safe, are hell on new concrete, due to the process of snowmelt causing way more freeze/thaw cycles.

Even though I put aquapel on last fall I didn’t even think about using any type of ice melt last winter. I wasn’t going to chance it. I was mostly concerned about my work vehicle melting snow with some salt over the top of it.

 

[Dr.DrakeRamoray]

I did self leveling on my old driveway. On my new I didn’t. You definitely need backer rod if you do self leveling. On new one I ran a small bead and tooled it with the butter knife tools you can get.

Yeah for the expansion joints I’ve already got backer rod and self leveling. I’m thinking it’s going to be my Sunday have the NFL on in the garage while I work project

 

[greybeardedchild]

Given the nightly temps we are seeing in Omaha doesn’t make sense to seal now or in the late spring? Lots of things I’ve seen say temps should be beaten 50-90 for 48 hours, we are getting under that nightly here

I don't have a great recommendation on sealer, call your local Whitecap or Carrol supply, ask what the big dogs are using, and follow the manufacturer recs on the product. I'd say imperfect application weather would still be better than taking a chance on another winter.

Also seal the control joints with SL1 or should just be sealing the expansion joints? I’ve seen countering opinions online

Best practice would also be to seal the control joints, once they start spalling it's hard to make it stop. Especially if they cut the joints with a soffcut or while the concrete was still too green, that can soften the edges of the cut and make it more prone to joint spalling.

The control joints on my driveway are so narrow it’s going to be a pain in the dick to do those

I think SL1 specifically calls for 1/4 joint width to work well. Rent a concrete saw and chase the joints with correct blade. (or two skinny blades on the arbor) Can be a pain in the dick tho.

Even though I put aquapel on last fall I didn’t even think about using any type of ice melt last winter. I wasn’t going to chance it. I was mostly concerned about my work vehicle melting snow with some salt over the top of it.

Yea I've seen perfect tire tracks peeled off, even if you're not using salt, you are tracking road de-icer chemical on when you pull into the driveway. That's super aggravating.

 

[HCFord1]

Anyone have a recommendation for someone who can replace a driveway and sidewalks in Omaha and does good work? Ours is old and falling apart, so will need to have it done in the spring most likely.

 

[Boondock_St_Sker]

My dad worked with concrete for decades…I believe every word graybeard typed. Also, my dad said there are two truths about concrete that stand the test of time. 1. Concrete will crack. 2. No one will steal it.

 

[Boondock_St_Sker]

Anyone have a recommendation for someone who can replace a driveway and sidewalks in Omaha and does good work? Ours is old and falling apart, so will need to have it done in the spring most likely.

This is my neighbor, did my garage, driveway, and front sidewalk 5 years ago. Fast and good.

FLC West concrete | Omaha View NE

FLC West concrete, Omaha View. 122 likes · 1 talking about this. FLC West Concrete LLC Commercial and residential does all kind of concrete work.

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